Parenting Help
Critical Thinking and the Bible #9: Parenting Advice
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Lol, true, true. He could have gone years without ever even speaking to some of his wives. Probably didn't remember all of their names. You'd never heard this before?
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and it probably cost him a fortune in hairdressing bills. serves him right. Have I heard of this before? Probably. It doesnt surprise me. Cultures were diferent in those days, we will probably look back on this decade and see the results of greed and wastage and oppulance, and be outraged. and we will probably say God wanted to bless us abundantly.
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adding to this though. I think things were included in the bible for a reason allbeit not literal.. Is that what they term as a metaphor.
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Well, in some veins, I'd agree with ya. Like, honestly, I don't think the Samson story was ever meant to be taken literally. I surmise that the writers intended Samson to be a story with a moral (like the boy who cried wolf or Little Red Riding Hood)… But "beat your son with a rod" is a pretty dangerous metaphor. Especially considering ancient Israel was a land in which parents did beat (and sometimes stoned to death) their children. By no means was it a kind, gentle place.
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Nathan ,have you seen my video ,"spare the rod spoil the child ?"
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I hadn't seen it, but I have now. Glad to see there are some folks on your side of the aisle who are carrying this torch too. If someone wants to apply that scripture to mean "making rules" that's fine with me. But many don't. And, to be honest, when I read it, "beat him with the rod" doesn't sound much like "give him rules." It sounds more like "beat him with the rod."
Anyhow, thanks for directing me toward your vid.
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Yes I am sure you are right, they used the rod, but how about "Thy rod and staff they comfort me". I am not disagreeing with you ,just chatting 🙂
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Good point. That IS a metaphor — a shepherding metaphor to be precise. The shepherd's staff was never used to beat the sheep. It could be used as a tool for tending sheep, or even as a weapon against predators. And in this case, as the sheep is walking 'through the valley of the shadow of death,' the latter is probably the sense the psalmist meant. Like, 'I fear no evil because you're protecting me with a big stick.'
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1) Well, your "first thing" only works if one accepts the presupposition that the Bible is God's word. Since the point of this video series is to examine the Bible and determine if it's logical to believe it's God's word, using that presupposition is a logical fallacy called circular reasoning or begging the question.
Also, presupposing that the Bible, and all that is within it, comes from God doesn't advance critical thinking. It actually stifles it.
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2) And your second point is a logical fallacy called a false dilemma. You present your question as if to say that one must either be willing to strike his or her child, or to kill his or her child. In reality, it's entirely possible to reject both options. Lots of people do.
So I'll answer this way: If a parent can only find within the Bible advice telling him/her to hit or kill his/her child, then he/she would be best off closing the Bible and looking elsewhere for good advice.
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BTW, thanks for all your input over the past couple of days.
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The questions I raised in the video were essentially "does it make sense that a wise and loving God would instruct you to do something harmful to your children?" and further "does it make sense that he would use a polygamous slave owner to deliver the message?" The answer to those questions cannot be "balance." It also cannot be, 'the Bible gives different advice in other places.'
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To ask in reply whether it's better to beat your kids, as the Bible says to do, or to kill your kids, as the Bible also says to do, only seems to demonstrate that the Bible contains lots of bad parenting advice!
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If you watched the video, you should know the answer to your question. Striking a child is harmful, and therefore is abuse. Beating it with a rod is certainly abuse. So yes, when the Bible says to beat a child with a rod, it's saying to abuse the child. Physical violence should not be a part of parenting. Violence against children should not be any part of a 'balanced' upbringing, just as violence against women shouldn't be part of a 'balanced' marriage.
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LOL!!!!!!!!!! I should tell you if it makes sense that the Bible says a parent should kill a child?… Ummm, have you actually watched my videos? Have you watched the video on Mosaic Justice?… Have you missed the point that I do not believe that the Bible is from God?
I'm not sure what kind of a response you were expecting with that question, but eh… Perhaps you should answer it yourself, rather than asking me to do it.
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Haha, well thanks for letting me know I'm wrong… One day maybe you'll realize that maybe I'm not so wrong after all — hopefully this will be before your children are grown, and all of the damage has been done.
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I don't believe I said anything that was an attack. However, your comment that insisted that sometimes, in your own words, "hitting a child [,,,] has it's benefits," indicates to me that you may already, or may one day, commit such acts of violence against children. Therefore I have expressed my hope that you will realize how harmful that can be before it's too late. By no means is that an attack.
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And what precisely is that reason? So far, this is the second comment on one of my videos in which you've said there was a reason for something, then neglected to say what that reason was.
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I'll bet I know what the reason is — you weren't sure yourself, and you wanted my opinion! You knew I'd give it to ya straight.
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Interesting that you associate someone saying "don't use violence against kids" with someone saying "don't discipline kids" (something I didn't say). That isn't a reflection of my arguments, but is a reflection of what first comes to your mind when you think of discipline. Disturbing.
And yes, many millions of children go through all kinds of trauma and grow up to be healthy, happy adults. It's a tribute to the resiliency of children.
And to your last statement — not to be unkind, but good.
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Read your own comments to me, and read my comments to you, and see who seems in reality to have the most "attitude"… Btw, I thought you weren't coming back to this discussion.
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Lol bye sacred.
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One remark: i was young it the 50's, and i was spanked many times by my mom, it don't give me a trauma. Because most of time she has right. For instance she spank me when i try to feel on the hot oven, on that moment she spank me on my hands with he hands, so it was not really violent. I think it preserve me for a lot for little injuries. So don't think to negative about it, sometimes you can use it also as a kind of pavlov reflex.
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This video doesn't make the claim that spanking never gets results in the short term, or that all kids who are spanked turn out to be maniacs. What is true, however, is that numerous studies of children who are spanked show drawbacks to the practice that are more than sufficient to state that spanking is harmful. Personal experiences of people who say, "I was spanked, and I turned out ok," do not negate this fact. (Cont'd)
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This cannot be stated too strongly: Arguments like, "I was spanked, and I turned out ok," are the same as arguments like, "My uncle Joe smoked four packs a day and lived to be ninety." Both statements may be true, but uncle Joe's longevity doesn't prove that smoking isn't harmful any more than your mental well-being proves that spanking isn't harmful.
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ad hominem fallacy?
Perhaps Solomon wise, but at the same time sinful enough to not follow his own wisdom that the Lord had given him. Can advice given by an advisor still be good if the advisor doesn't follow it?
I don't think it says in the book of proverbs that it is good to have sex slaves. He may have known it is wrong or unwise(having the gift of wisdom) and still did it anyway.
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@zunathanzu Not ad hominem. Think of it this way, if you were given business advice by someone known to have crashed a number of businesses due to faulty decision making, you wouldn't automatically take the advice based on his authority, would you? So you research the advice he's given you, and find out others have followed this advice, and have often experienced problems as a result. You probably would decide not to take his advice… (cont'd)
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@zunathanzu (cont'd) Part of your decision would likely be based on his failed history — in essence, his failures would lead you to conclude that he is not a reliable expert in his field. This isn't an ad hominem fallacy at all. Plus, in the video, the point is to ask, If advice comes from one you wouldn't conclude was a reliable source, and evidence and common sense tell you it isn't wise advice, why would you conclude it came from God?
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I am a believer and that's not really what it means. That passage means that parents need to be in control of their children, they need to properly guide them… You took the passage too literal. And also consider the times. These days we know how to reinforce behaviors in children in a way that they did not know 2,000 years ago.
God used Solomon because he was flawed as a human to show us that He loves us despite our flaws.
I do enjoy your point of view and I can appreciate an even agree with most of it.
thanks.
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